I’m swapping out the 2 barrel for a Holley 4 barrel and want to switch the “fuel pump to carb” line from the existing 5/16" to 3/8.“. From my understanding, all 68’s have a 3/8” line from tank to pump…hopefully. I cant double check at this time as the car is put away in storage…and whether its a fitting or hose barb for both fuel pump connections.
I’m trying to determine if I need to swap out the fuel pump, and then bend a new 3/8" hard line from pump to filter to carb? I’m assuming I cant use a standard “Classic Tubes” hardline as I will be using a dual feed carb (either PART# 0-80783C or PART# 0-86670BK) and an inline fuel filter…thus the connections are not the same as a factory 4 barrel.
I know I could probably just buy a new high volume pump, length of 3/8 fuel line, and adapters and make it work, but would like to try an keep things looking original where possible.
I don’t think there is any advantage to it - the factory used 5/16" tubing with the Holley on every Cougar except the two Boss 429 cars. By using a front Holley Dominator float bowl and the Ford fuel filter and transfer tube the factory 5/16" line connects just perfectly to the generic motors style Holley carb.
Ok, keeping 5/16” line should make it easier then. I added a pic of a generic dual inlet fuel feed. I would screw in a 5/16” barb adapter for connection to the hardline. I’m still looking for a better type of dual fuel line…don’t really want a chrome or billet one.
The only problem I see with this setup, is my existing hard line terminates fairly close to where the carb would be…for original short hose to original screw in fuel filter. By the time I add an inline fuel filter (assuming I don’t use the mesh ones in carb), that doesnt leave any room in the area…it’s all jammed in that same area.
It seems I should either rebend the hard line, or cutoff 3”- 6” of the hardline and reflare…either would seem to allow room for a hardline to filter to carb dual feed connector.
I’m sure I’m making this way too hard…thus the reason I love pics.
Just an observation but your sure spending allot of time considering things that work against your stated goal. I suggest that you really think about where you’re going them make choices based on what will get you there. Waffling back and forth often costs more time and effort along with a car that looks like you did not have a theme or solidifying goal. Know that its your car and who caries what others think. Most people still want their efforts acknowledged and positive feed back
Just an opinion Grew up with and use to build custom race and show cars before I figured out restoring cars was so much easier
I don’t mind spending a little time now to go over things…easier before I making major purchases or go down a certain path. Besides, things are a bit slow with COVID keeping us home…have time to investigate.
My goal is to keep the car stock like, but improve things where needed so I can enjoy it here in Colorado. I’m trying to find OE or era correct solutions where possible, but don’t mind deviating if needed due to cost or tech reasons as long as it still looks good.
For now, just looking to upgrade power with an aluminum Blue Thunder intake and Holley carb, new Shelby style wheels, and rear leafs to level it out. I believe they will look good together with out being a hodgepodge.
So back to my original post…working on how to connect a new Holley 4150 carb with dual feed inlets to my stock pump via 5/16” hard lines with a factory like look if I can.
Royce provided good input, but don’t know if I can modify the new carb as suggested…how to install the fuel filter on drivers side of carb…didn’t think they were threaded on these universal Holleys.
I have done a few hidden Cobra Jet strokers, where we restore it to look concours-ish, but make 550+ hp. I have been doing two things for the fuel system
1 - I convert the fuel bowls to dual inlet, if required and run this larger crossover tube. (on a 390 the stock crossover tube is fine, but it’s so small it can’t keep up with a 461 and 560 HP or so
2 - The filter side can be tough because nobody makes an affordable or replaceable Boss 9 filter (3/8 inlet disposable), so we did this on the last one, it is an Edelbrock filter, with the name turned back behind. Keep in mind, Classic Tubes can make anything you want.
This was actually an original Ford “dollar car” racer, 68.5 CJ coupe, we built the engine with an alum intake as the owner wanted to build it as a racer which would have had some modifications each year, but you get the idea
3 - I don’t think there is a pump with a 3/8 outlet that looks stock, if anyone knows of one, let me know, it would be a handy thing to have in my back pocket
Now as far as power and performance, I would not say a stock-ish 390 needs more than a 5/16 up to about 400 HP, beyond that I would be looking to upgrade, and remember, that includes the feed and pickup too. If not upgrading those, you are only doing it for looks the pressure side is less sensitive than the pickup side
Just a thought, put filter before pump just under the power steering pump. Wix 33033 or Fram G3 clear so you cam monitor dirt/contaminates w/ lust a look.
Thanks…that’s exactly what I’m trying to do :-). I was thinking of using that stock looking crossover tube…Royce mentioned it as well. Will check that fuel filter…easy solution turning it around. I was thing of purchasing a tube bender and flaring tools…don’t mind trying it myself…will keep classic tubes in mind though.
How did you modify the carb to accept fuel on the other side of the bowl though? The driver side ports aren’t threaded…or don’t appear to be.
I’m looking at the Holley 0-80783C for stockish look, or maybe Ultra Street Avenger for billet base and glass fuel sights. I’m open to potentially buying a factory 390 4 barrel and trying to find a good carb rebuilder, but I like an electric choke. I’ll stick with 5/16 fuel line as it appears my stock power levels don’t require more.
On a related note. There is a small section of rubber hose that merges the back to front hard lines. It’s located next to the driver’s side subframe rail. These rot out and can eventually cause a fuel leak. I’d replace it with a new piece since your working on the fuel system.
Good suggestion. I want to replace any fuel hose with something that will better resist ethanol in today’s fuel, although I have new local station that sells “ethanol free” that I will be using.
Not the answer to the question you asked, but if I had your car I would leave the manifold on it and buy the Sniper 2V EFI system, add A Pertronix II, and leave everything else as is. It will improve drive-ability and reliability and be easily reversible should any one ever care to.
The 390 2V when in top tune is a such a great driver. It has tons of torque and it can handle a 2.79 rear axle ration that will let you keep up eith freeway traffic. If you need to make some tire smoke you can still do that, just hold your foot on the brake for a second to break the tires loose and it’ll keep baking away. The Cougar is a great cruiser. If you really want to have fun with it add a good passenger and get out an drive. No one but you will ever notice that you added a four barrel and a headers. The first time you get on it, it’ll go a little faster and make a lot more noise. Then you will drive it just like you always did. Except you will be a little paranoid about how well all those modes were done. What makes the Sniper so good is that it is constantly adjusting itself so you don’t have to.
Thanks for the input. I went back and forth on exactly that…whether I stick with 2 barrel and ultimately a Sniper 2V, or install a new intake to drop weight and install 4 barrel or Sniper 4V. I decided at the time to go with the new intake/carb for a bit more power and dropping some weight.
Maybe I’ll have to think a bit more about this before I swap intake/carb, and focus on a tune up (plugs, cap, wires) to try and address a slight miss I noticed before putting it away for storage. I can see how happy I am with the drivability at that point. It currently has the Pertronix I installed, which I re-wired (via relay) to a switched 12v source…previous owner had the original source.
The weight difference, if it makes any difference at all, will result in the front sitting higher than it already does.
Carbs depend entirely on the velocity of air passing through the venturi to generate the vacuum that pulls fuel out of the fuel bowl. At low engine speeds the venturi needs to be fairly small to generate enough vacuum. So a two barrel with really big venturies would bog badly at low engine speeds. So the solution is to add more small venturies; 4 barrel. The manifold needs to keep the fuel air mix in suspension. When you add the extra two barrels the manifold design needs to change to accommodate the additional two venturies.
EFI uses mechanical pressure to spray gas into the incoming air stream as determined by the computer looking the O2 level in the exhaust. While engine vacuum is one of the variables the computer is reading the function of fuel delivery is not effected by vacuum. For this reason you can have a much larger venturies in the EFI system and not have bogging issues. This is why you will see the same Sniper for everything from a 260 to a 429. You are good up to an honest 350 HP. The big difference is how well the car runs. The truth is we have all been driving fuel injected cars so long that we have forgotten about all the little hickups that carbed engines present.
This appears to be a complete kit to convert a 4150 style carb for a transfer tube between bowls and threaded fuel inlet on drivers side of primary fuel bowl.
If I decide to move forward with the intake / 4 barrel install in spring/summer, this looks like the kit I will purchase…has all of the parts I need to convert the carb to somewhat of a clone of an original 4 barrel, and able to use a new classic tubes 5/16” stock pump to carb line like the original 4 barrels…decent OE look after install.
To be honest, the only thing slowing me down is the new intake install. I know it’s not hard by paying attention and taking time, but concerned with gremlins (vacuum leaks, intake not fitting correctly, stabbing the distributor back in, etc). I’ve done 351W tear downs in a 96 Bronco and Rousch style blower on a 2013 Coyote without problems, but haven’t done an FE for ages.
Grew up with and use to build custom race and show cars before I figured out restoring cars was so much easier