Back to Brian’s idea…is it not a feasible idea? I actually thought about it before he posted, but didn’t want to sound dumb (Not saying your dumb Brian 
) I wasn’t thinking of that high of dollar amount though, so obviously a few more investors than what he mentioned.
I suppose with the auction being only 2 days out yet it is too late for pulling a plan together though.
Shame something so unique ended up in the condition it is. Didn’t the person know what they were ‘sitting’ on?
I know I’m new to this forum but Im not new to cars. There is no way this car is going to be valued anywhere near 200k. Literally nothing on the car will be original by the time its restored. It might as well be a recreation. Very neat car, but it has no story and an abusive past. Maybe it brings 60-70k restored, a stretch would be 100k. A big bucks car has the history and the patina as raced.
Agree.
Well what 68 CJ 4spd cars have sold within the last few years? What did they go for?
I have been just wondering, did any potential buyers ever have someone or come to inspect vehicle?
No. Though several have contacted me, made offers to end the auction and are planning on bidding right before the auction ends. They all seemed satisfied by the 100 or so photos provided.
The price of this car will fall between a recreation and a numbers matching restored, no history car. Find those two prices and split the difference. The list of negatives on this car being a 200k car is staggering
non numbers matching, dif, engine, trans
3-4 paint jobs
large number of history gaps
no racing history
no celebrity history
needs rust repair on almost every panel, plus entire roof cut
needs extensive and costly full restoration, further making it not original as sold condition
interior is beyond saving even for a patina car
OK… but what have real R-code 4spd cars sold for in the last few years? Five years?
The only one I know of is:
- Matching numbers, all original drive train
- GT-E
- Original paint
- Low mileage
- Original family ownership since new
- Running and driving perfectly
- No rust
- Perfect original interior
In other words, not in any way comparable to the current auction.
Royce, are you talking about the Owlshead green GTE car?
Yes. It lives about 3 miles from my house.
So we know there were only 3 GTE 428 CJ cars. However the 428 CJ was available in non gte cars as this one is. How many of those were 4 sp? Any recent sales history on a non GTE 428CJ. No way can this car be compared to a matching numbers GTE
The finished restored value of this car will have more to do with the quality of the restoration than anything else. We will soon know the current market value of an R code 4 speed 4.30 axle VIN number on a very rusty original chassis with a nice collection of desirable but not matching parts. It is very unlikely that the original engine and transmission will ever show up, so factor that in. On the up side, since these cars almost never show up for sale the phrase “find another one” comes into play. My gut feeling is that this car will be bought by a hobbyist that could not afford a restored car. They can invest the time needed to search out the parts, and acquire them as they become available. In the mean time they will have a very cool piece of garage art with a great story. It’ll probably be a 5 to 10 year process that will be more labor of love than anything else. The $200K number will probably help with the spousal acceptance factor, but the market will need to just about double to ever realize that number.
There were 48 standards and 16 XR-7’s ( 3 were GT-E’s as you pointed out, 3 were G’s and I don’t know the breakdown of the other 10, ie: XR-7/GT etc., Bill Quay is the 68 R-code registrar(Non GT-E) for the CCOA.
Well stated Bill. A $200K car is one that’s bought by a serious collector, not a guy reliving his childhood. They care about things like numbers matching and whether the car still has it’s original roof.
You mean the Green GTE that had a big spot of missing paint and red primer the size of a plum on the hood, paint buff through and thin paint all over the car, two previous collision repairs as documented in the service records, cracked paint on those two repairs including the left rear quarter panel that did not match the rest of the car, a hood that was a different color and fresh rust repairs on the lower panels? The one that had all of the paint flaking off around the XR7 emblem from a poor respray? The one you stated had a “perfect original interior” but in reality, both front seats were heavily cracked and looked dirty? The one that did not have several components installed including smog and the original carb not on it? The one that had a restored engine compartment, so it was not all “survivor”? Was that rear mounted power antenna stock?
“I saw this car once, in 1995, when the brother, who has since passed away owned it. I’ve talked to the brother who inherited many times over the years. While the car “had” what I would consider minor rust issues, it is what it is represented to be, as far as I can tell.” Cougar 1
I am not slamming the green GTE as much as being realistic about the condition of this $228,000 car compared to my car once PROPERLY restored.
Royce, you are in the Cougar game DEEP. Considered by many to be at the top of the game knowledge wise, and I would have to agree. You know of many cars and have the inside track of cars that are out there and ones that have sold that the general public does not hear about, and even YOU only know of ONE 1968 428cj 4spd Cougar that has sold at any time within the last several years and that one shattered the World record for ALL Cougars, even with the numerous flaws it has. Only one. That speaks volumes as far as the rarity of 68.5 4spd staggered shock Cougars, much less a 4:30 traction Lok car. As you personally know, it is the 4spd that drives the lust and envy for these cars. When has another sold?
Here is what you said about the Owlshead green GTE……
“The LR quarter panel looks to be a different shade in the view at 1:36. Obviously that quarter has been repainted entirely.” Royce
“Lots of incorrect stuff under the hood. Missing smog. Ram air lid painted the wrong color.
I like the idea of owning the car, would like to see information on the rear differential, engine block and heads and transmission to see if they are the original parts. The knowledgeable seller would present those things to attract bidder interest. The auction being held in Maine is not going to fetch top dollar in my opinion.” Royce
Now it seems that according to you the green car is perfect when comparing it to mine, but before not so much. According to you, this green car was not going to fetch top dollar, just like you now say about mine once restored. Even experts can be wrong is my point. It set a World record, even though the air cleaner lid was panted the wrong color. 
“I know the car, marketed properly it could hit $175k. Not sure this was the best way to market it.” Don Rush (referencing the green GTE pre-auction)
Don Rush has stated my car is a $200k car properly restored. He was $53,000 UNDER the mark on the Green GTE. Is he now $50,000 or more OVER valuing this car? I think not.
“It exceeded my expectations… I had it at the high of $180,000 and Don next at $175,000 I really didn’t think it would break the $200,000 mark let alone below it away at $228,800!!” Bosselim9
While you may be correct that my car is not “comparable” to the green GTE once restored, but you can’t compare my unrestored car to the green car as-is. According the registry, there are only seven known 428cj 4spd 4:30 cars with three known to have been parted out and NONE in restored condition. Once fully and correctly restored, date coded everything including the proper ram air cleaner painted the correct colors, it is my opinion that there are MANY collectors that would much rather have a red car, a fresh correct restoration, and a completely rebuilt date code correct drivetrain over an older preserved car showing many flaws. One that they might not worry about adding miles to once it is shown and judged. Mostly what will matter to them will be the marti-report and the fact it is a REAL R-code 4spd. Many people, including myself would have a real hard time looking past that cracked and mismatched paint every time I went to get in that car and sitting on that cracked, dry, dirty looking TAN leather seat, especially after paying almost a quarter of a million dollars to buy it. Plus I would be stuck with it in that condition because it would be a sin to restore it.
Will the market shun “little red” because it needed rust repair, a full front clip and was found with no drivetrain?
With a proper restoration and high marks in judging, I think this car would surpass the mark set by that GTE. But that’s just my personal and admittedly biased opinion. Only time will really tell. The auction for this unrestored car has over 11,000 views and will likely top 15,000 views before it is over. There are over 600 people watching and it is the second highest watched car on ebay. Apparently, there is a LOT of interest in this car despite all of its flaws. I think there would be an even greater interest once it was restored and offered for sale. Perhaps even enough interest to set a new Worlds record.
Between this and the MU GTE I’ve been eating a lot of popcorn!
They are both extremely cool cars.
I still think for an “Untamed Elegance” Cougar guy the green one is the holy grail. Augusta Green, saddle interior, XR-7, 4-speed GT-E? Still gives me hot flashes.
Now perhaps for a muscle car/drag race Cougar guy, maybe the red one is the holy grail.
In either case they are (will be) about a decimal place out of my price range.
This has been a good discussion of a very rare Cougar. For some this is pretty close to the ultimate Cougar (although I wish it was a XR7!). For others, the ultimate Cougar would be a GTE, Boss Eliminator, or 428CJ convertible or even Cougar #1. Bottom line is that a detailed proper restoration to the highest standard will easily be $100K or more. The car should be worth at least that when finished, so the new owner shouldn’t be upside down.
Karguy don’t take offense at the comments posted, you should be very happy that you picked this car up for a steal of a price, and will now be rewarded by a big pay day for being at the right place at the right time. Knowledge is power, and I’m sure all the rest of us are somewhat jealous that we didn’t find the same deal before you.
A few more photos.
Please ensure the person who wins the auction updates the ownership with Bill Quay the 1968 428cj “R Code” Registrar. Bills contact information is listed on www.CougarClub.org.
My email is Chair@CougarClub.org if I can help the new owner in any way.
Phillip Payne did an amazing job with the Anniversary T-Shirts which are also available on www.CougarClub.org
