Is there an upgrade from the stock set up that does not require using drum spindles?
If I understand your question. You have stock disc brakes now and want to improve on them using the stock spindles? You can always upgrade the rotor to a high performance one, upgrade the calipers and upgrade the pads. I hope that helps? PM me if you would like to talk
sure is, pick your flavor
https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/BrakeKitSearch?year=1968&make=Mercury&model=Cougar&option=Disc+Brake+Spindle&axle=Front+Kit
I found this kit to be a cost effective solution for me to ditch the Granada setup that came on my car. I very happy with it and its much nicer then what I had previously. This will work with your factory disc or drum spindles.
https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/BrakeKitsProdFront?itemno=140-13476-DR&year=1968&make=Mercury&model=Cougar&option=Disc+Brake+Spindle
I installed a Wilwood kit on my 68 with drum brake spindles. The kit was a direct bolt on with the drum brake spindles. The same kit can also be installed on disc brake spindles-however the disc brake spindles need specific machine work to be modified to work. I suggest you read Wilwood’s assembly instructions before ordering as they detail the required work. Not sure I would modify a set of stock disc brake spindles in case I wanted to go back to a stock setup. Might be worth finding a drum brake set of spindles.
Sorry I could have given better detail. I have a stock XR7 with front disc brakes and I am putting in a new rear end that has had a disc brake conversion (mustang steve) . I know the rears will now be better than the stock front.
On that, all the disc break conversions I have found convert from drum to disc with drum spindles and I have not found any that just upgrade mine. I can probably locate a set of stock drum spindles but I have that feeling I am going backwards to go forward.
Thanks for the advise.
Its only a drill and tapping a couple holes for the caliper bracket. No need for a machine shop. OEM spindles have been harder to come by lately even drum spindles. Not a bad idea to save your original disc spindles unmodified just in case there ever was a need for them. There are a couple places that make aftermarket spindles that might be an option to. Either way if you have a drill and a set of taps its an easy install with no machine shop needed.
tapping the holes for the factory dust cover to fit the caliper bracket
bracket mounting, same bracket if using drum spindles just use different holes
I used a 70mustang kit since my wheel bearings are larger with the Granada spindles on my car. Everything else is identical to the 68 cougar/mustang kit however
What kit # is that??
Im running a 70mustang kit due to my specific spindles on my car so my kit wont be the same as you need. This is what you need for a 68 cougar with factory disc brakes. Note several numbers based on rotor type(drilled or non) and caliper color. Price varies based on options so be mindful, I found the best price from from summit racing. You get everything you need too, brake lines, new bearings, seals etc.
Have you switched master cylinder yet? You may need to do so with the rear disc kit you have installed since factory is a disc/drum combination.
Thanks,
Conveniently Summit is 5 minutes from my house and it is in stock.
I would be in trouble if summit was that close to me. Its already bad enough they ship stuff fast enough its to my door in 2 days or less!
I hear ya, JEGS warehouse is 15min from my house.
Wow!
Looking at the disc spindle conversion… Do you REALLY want to put your entire front brake system on two 3/8" bolts??? Yes I see that there are three, but one is a slotted hole and isn’t gonna hold shite when you hit the binders in an emergency, if the other two bolts shear off. Yes, they appear to use grade 8 bolts, but they can break more easily in “shear” vs clamp…need to look up strength “in shear”… (MSC .com would have this info listed in their catalogs)
Factory disc brake calipers are held in place with single grade 8, 7/16" and 1/2" bolts physically held in place in a bracket preventing them from rotating by design and then again physically by the design of the smaller caliper bracket. Even if the two smaller caliper bolts (the slider “pins”) managed to break the caliper would only be able to push up and out (think what it takes to get your caliper off…) and it would hit the rim, at least with stock wheels, before it went into hyperspace.
I don’t want to think of what would happen if you managed to bust the three bolts in this design. Would not be pretty.
If doing the disc swap, I would strongly recommend using the drum spindles and the 4 bolt design, as was used in 1967. Hopefully the bolt holes will line up with NON slotted holes.
Of course that is if you ever plan on using the car hard, as on a track, or in an emergency. If all you are doing is posing, or driving on and off a trailer, by all means use the 3 hole conversion… OR simply paint your factory calipers red, or some other fancy color that meets your needs! If you ever sell the car, hope that the subsequent buyers never have a problem and come back after you for doing something sub standard.
Most people do not realize that aftermarket parts that are being sold do NOT need to go thru rigorous testing to be released upon the unknowing or unsuspecting public!!! Unless you are building catalytic convertors… These must be at least CA certified…for use in CA. Brakes? Nope!
Also, you may not need to change your master cylinder. Only two and a half reasons to do so, 1) to change the bore size, to effect different hydraulic characteristics of the system. Do you need a harder pedal or softer, high engagement or lower engagement… Look it up and learn. 2) The M/C may have a back flow restrictor in the rear circuit. Purpose is to prevent wheel cylinders from slamming back in their bores when the foot is taken off of the pedal! Big retractor springs! Discs do not have this! What I have seen as restrictors, really don’t do much for small amounts of fluid back flowing. Disc pistons really don’t move that much, thousandths of an inch, simply to retract the pads from the rotors, as the rotors do ride on a cushion of air. 2.5) The drum reservoir piece of the disc/drum M/C is typically smaller. Rear disc pistons are typically smaller than fronts… All this means is that as your pads wear, and rear pads wear less typically than fronts, your fluid level will go down…and you should CHECK it every once in an oil change or two!!! That simple.
If you have an inline pressure valve, as I have seen on some Fairlanes, not Mustangs, you would be well served to remove those. They were there to keep the brake shoes closer to the drums longer…improve the brake pedal feel the second time you hit the pedal. These WOULD keep the disc pistons “out” and potentially against the discs…not a good thing.
As for adjustable proportioning valves, try your original first! This is hotrodding, not throw darts engineering. You do what you need to do, not what you “think” you need to do because someone on a web forum said you “had to do”! Once you have your brakes ALL in place, go out and test for proper lockup. You have likely change your tires and wheels, suspension heights, altering road contact and weight balances, center of gravity, roll.
Read a book on performance braking systems, they are out there and readily available, so no reason to NOT be informed of what you are about to do!!! Only then, make adjustments. You build an engine, you test it on a dyno and adjust it, then install it (or you run it on a chassis dyno and tune accordingly.) Just dropping it in the car and hoping that it will run right the first time is uncommon and sort of lame thinking. There is always something…!
Companies like Wilwood will never tell you exactly what to do to your car. They sell parts. Just like the auto parts store. Their primary interest is selling parts… How many times have you heard “this will work” in your car vs “this is the correct replacement part”? Windsor thermostats installed in Cleveland engines or even 4.6L late model mod motors!!! Sure they fit, but they certainly DON’T WORK right! But these places will sell them to you no problem!!!
Be smart about making changes to your cars, definitely where your (and others!) safety is concerned! Get informed! Buy a $20 book and learn something! Then reconsider what you actually NEED for your car.
Drive safe!
Steve
Steve you do make some valid points but I also believe this scenario is very very unlikely to happen as you describe, There are 10 other things I would be worried about driving a car of this era besides aftermarket disc brakes. If I had felt unsafe with the wilwood product I would not have used it and yes this particular kit has its pros and cons but would not consider it unsafe. While wilwood may not(assuming they did not) have invested millions of dollars on designing a brake system for a particular car they certainly are no amateur in the braking world and have been successively making brake products for all types of applications for decades so I believe they know what they are doing. I would be more worried about some kits people toss together using different calipers and rotors from other models and retrofitting them on to their car. If I had wanted to put the car on the track or drive it like a race car I would have choose something different for the application. Yes I drive my car and do not trailer or show it, I actually wanted a gray or black caliper to blend in and not stick out for attention.
Being that Felix has a disc setup car now and wants to upgrade his master cylinder will likely work just fine. My car was a drum front and rear car originally and had the wrong one. I simply used the factory disc/drum master and was good to go.
I do agree to get educated if you plan to work on your car yourself. Talk to others, get educated on what your doing and why so you can make the right choice for yourself. While books are helpful first hand knowledge is even better. Forums like these are also a great resource to see what others have done and why. Its always great to hear both sides of the coin as well so thanks for your input!