which one will build up to more power, 351 Cleveland or Windsor?
There is no clear answer on this question. There are great parts for Windsors nowadays, used to be (back in the day) a Cleveland was hands down the winner (before major aftermarket parts came along).
Having said that, I have been a Cleveland fan forever. The semi-hemi head configuration and the looks of the engine are poetry to me.
My latest and current engine, a 408 Cleveland:
I’m in the 12’s in a 4150 lb car and have just begun getting things dialed-in (4 passes). It’s a low 12 second car/engine with great street manners and a total blast to drive (I try to behave but it is very hard!).
Show Off “'m in the 12’s in a 4150 lb car and have just begun getting things dialed-in. It’s a low 12 second car/engine with great street manners and a total blast to drive (I try to behave but it is very hard!).” 
Now having cleaned the drool off my chin at seeing Bob’s latest creation back to the question at hand.
2nd the windsor opinion evan tho I too have a Cleve. 
What’s your engine build? 1969XR7Vert
Allen, I have it documented, I will grab that (it’s at work) and will post it on Monday.
Alright thanks
Sorry Catsrock, I do not mean to be boastful, but with a Cleveland Rockin’, it’s hard to be demure…
I wonder since they can stick a 302 into a Miata why not a 408?
I bet it would be an instant 8 second car.
Dude it aint boastin when its true 
One sweet ride for sure 
Unfortunately I don’t have the cajones to put my vert on the track but the bug is gnawing at me especially since i’ve been helping my friend with his 69 camaro. Maybe I’ll run across another phat cat in the future to fill both sides
Allen,
Here is the build info I promised:
408 Cleveland Stroker consisting of the following:
- 1970 D0AE Engine Block
o Bored 0.030” over and honed with deck plates for 0.0035” piston to cylinder clearance
o Decks milled to 0.005” piston to deck clearance
o Half-Filled with Hard Blok Water Jacket Filler (cement with iron in it) - Scat Forged 408ci 1-46265BE Stroker kit
o 4340 Forged Steel 4-inch Stroke Crankshaft
o 4340 6-inch Forged Steel H-Beam Connecting Rods with 7/16” ARP 8740 Rod Bolts
o Racetec Forged Aluminum stroker pistons
o Perfect Circle File-fit Moly rings
o Clevite H-Series Race Bearings
o Professional Products 8000 Series Harmonic Balancer
o PRW 164 tooth SFI-Rated Billet Steel Flywheel - MPG Head Service Oil Windage Tray
- Melling Standard Volume Oil Pump
o ARP Billet Oil Pump Driveshaft - Comp Cams Custom Hydraulic Roller Camshaft
o 0.622”/0.626” Lift, 234/238 Duration @0.050” lift, 110 LSA, installed on 107 degree ICL - Lunati 72335 Street Performance Link Bar Lifters
- Smith Brothers Custom Length 3/8” Chrome Moly Pushrods
- Procomp/Speedmaster Stainless Steel Roller Rocker Arms
- Rollmaster CS3130 Gold Series Double Roller Timing Set with Torrington Roller Bearing
- Trick Flow PowerPort® Cleveland 195, CNC Street Ported, 62cc Chamber Cylinder Heads
o Procomp/Speedmaster 3/8” Pushrod Guide Plates
o ARP Rocker Arm Studs
o Ferrea 5000 Series Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves
o Trick Flow Stainless Steel Intake Valves - Procomp/Speedmaster Cylinder Head Stud Kit
- Procomp/Speedmaster Multi Layer Steel Head Gaskets
- Hooker 6920-1HKR Ceramic Coated Headers
- Edelbrock 7564 Air Gap Intake Manifold
- Quick Fuel Technologies SS-750-AN Super Street Carburetor, 750 cfm, Annular Boosters, Electric Choke, Mechanical Secondary, Dual Inlet
- MSD 6530 Programmable Digital CD Ignition with Rev Limiter, MSD 6AL-2
I have not yet installed the MSD 6530, the 408C install schedule in the spring was a little tight with my desire to go to the Cruisin’ Ocean City, Md. event and so I elected to continue running the MSD 6AL Isabel started her new life with for now. The 6530 will go in after the 2015 show season slows down.
That thing is over the top awesome. I love it
Thanks Allen. Here, let me take you for a 12.9 second ET @ 110 MPH 1/4 mile ride!:
Sorry but I had to comment and add a video. This is my other “cat” – a Jaguar. Heh heh. 12.3 @ 117.6 with full AC and leather. Comments on the C vs W build follow
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqBdKGmXiW8
So which to build? As stated the old Cleveland would out power the Windsor but head technology has been focused on the Windsor. So what would I do? Well it depends. If I had a Cleveland and parts I would stick with it. The Windsor easily makes 650HP for less than the Cleveland. The Cleveland has a certain cool factor and can crest 700+HP if you have the coin. There are new 4-bolt blocks out there and killer aluminum heads. You are going to pay more for the build if you want killer HP going with the Cleveland.
I converted from Cleveland to Windsor and went 11.20’s in street trim. That’s a full street car coming in at 3655 lbs.
So…what are you going to do?
A great way to start the day watching a Cougar go down the 1/4 from the drivers seat. The only drawback to the 351C is the weight compared to the 351W, but those alum heads help.
Does a Cleveland long block really weigh more than a Windsor? Anyone have references to cite?
Here’s one (but do not know the original source of the info): http://pantera.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/5650045562/m/342101766 25 lbs less on the Windsor.
I’m a Cleveland guy.I have had a couple, and they just seemed to breathe much better and respond to upgrades (big valves and ports tend to do that) Although my '68 has a 289, I’d jump on a cleveland for another project, if anything for nostalgia’s sake.Yeah they cost more to build, but might as well do what you want. Did anyone check out the 400m that spanked the engine shootout in Hot Rod? I know there were some one-off pieces, but maybe someone in the aftermarket will wake up to the potential of a canted valved head.
That the aftermarket has finally started to support the Cleveland is a big bonus. After market heads weren’t a reality unless you got some of the Australian pieces (which I understand were very good). But that’s changing. Yeah, I’d go cleveland, but that’s just the “new guy’s” opinion.